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	<title>Comments on: Open Thread: Which Eco-Issue Keeps You Up at Night?</title>
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	<link>http://blog.nature.org/2009/11/open-thread-which-eco-issue-keeps-you-up-at-night/</link>
	<description>A blog on conservation, from migratory birds to coral reefs, from rainforests to climate change to personal green technology.</description>
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		<title>By: Pali-nalu</title>
		<link>http://blog.nature.org/2009/11/open-thread-which-eco-issue-keeps-you-up-at-night/comment-page-2/#comment-160797</link>
		<dc:creator>Pali-nalu</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Oct 2011 15:07:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.nature.org/?p=8123#comment-160797</guid>
		<description>Population - The most recent U.N. projections of an eighth, ninth, and tenth billion by century&#039;s end promise potentially calamitous humanitarian, civilizational, and biospheric crises - and at some point, we are likely to find that &quot;challenging&quot; has transitioned to calamitous - and the high-fertility projections of 15.8 billion by 2100 are the demographic equivalent of a collision trajectory with a near-earth asteroid.

The U.N.&#039;s high-fertility projections, for example, (which may well be the numbers that threaten to emerge) show us on-track toward our eighth, ninth, tenth, ELEVENTH, TWELFTH, THIRTEENTH, FOURTEENTH, and 15.8 billion by the close of this century.

In that case, the 15.8 billion near-earth asteroid analogy becomes operative, for conservation efforts have no chance whatsoever of success in the face of such numbers. If, for example, astronomers were to discover a near-earth asteroid on a collision trajectory with our planet, NASA and international space agencies would IMMEDIATELY initiate efforts to “nudge” the object out of its collisions trajectory, but that “nudging” effort would have to BEGIN when the object is still far enough way for the efforts to have an effect. If we are to avoid the 15.8 billion humanitarian, civilizational, and biospheric outcomes, the emergency demographic efforts that are needed now are NOT articles like the one above, but immediate steps to ensure that voluntary and ethical family planning programs are universally accessible in the world’s poorest and highest-fertility LDCs – for with every hour, day, and week that current high-fertility rates persist have the effect, due to population momentum, of locking the entirety of humankind, civilization, and the biosphere more and more inescapably into the collision trajectory.)

Speaking as a biologist, earth’s planetary carrying capacity for a modern industrialized humanity with everyone on earth enjoying a U.S. / Western European standard of living is on the order of TWO billion on less and the U.N.’s most recent medium-fertility population projections show humankind to be on-track toward ten billion by the end of this century. We know that humanity was already inflicting damage on earth’s ecosystems, biota, and planetary life support machinery back in 1987 with five billion and 1999 with six billion – when less than half of us were industrialized. Now we are at SEVEN billion and ocean dead zones are spreading, bluefin tuna and shark populations are plunging, deforestation in Sumatra reached rates of 61% over a period of twelve years in the 1980s, and on and on.
 
Graphs depicting human population growth over the past 10,000 years are accessible at http://www.flickr.com/photos./pali_nalu and readers will notice that they are not JUST J-curves (like those J-curve events the world witnessed at Hiroshima and Nagasaki), but they are extreme and pronounced J-curves.  (Population is not just affected by birth rates – think about mortality reductions; biologists have already achieved SIX-FOLD life-extensions in laboratory organisms – that would be a 500-year extension in humans – and even a tiny, tiny fractional such increase in humans would send us careening toward 15.8 billion.
 
For a short freely-downloadable downloadable PDF on population and the implications of our sheer physical eradication of natural systems (Conservation - Why 10% goals are not enough”) – readers are invited to visit http://www.scribd.com/TheWecskaopProject (What Every Citizen Should Know About Our Planet).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Population &#8211; The most recent U.N. projections of an eighth, ninth, and tenth billion by century&#8217;s end promise potentially calamitous humanitarian, civilizational, and biospheric crises &#8211; and at some point, we are likely to find that &#8220;challenging&#8221; has transitioned to calamitous &#8211; and the high-fertility projections of 15.8 billion by 2100 are the demographic equivalent of a collision trajectory with a near-earth asteroid.</p>
<p>The U.N.&#8217;s high-fertility projections, for example, (which may well be the numbers that threaten to emerge) show us on-track toward our eighth, ninth, tenth, ELEVENTH, TWELFTH, THIRTEENTH, FOURTEENTH, and 15.8 billion by the close of this century.</p>
<p>In that case, the 15.8 billion near-earth asteroid analogy becomes operative, for conservation efforts have no chance whatsoever of success in the face of such numbers. If, for example, astronomers were to discover a near-earth asteroid on a collision trajectory with our planet, NASA and international space agencies would IMMEDIATELY initiate efforts to “nudge” the object out of its collisions trajectory, but that “nudging” effort would have to BEGIN when the object is still far enough way for the efforts to have an effect. If we are to avoid the 15.8 billion humanitarian, civilizational, and biospheric outcomes, the emergency demographic efforts that are needed now are NOT articles like the one above, but immediate steps to ensure that voluntary and ethical family planning programs are universally accessible in the world’s poorest and highest-fertility LDCs – for with every hour, day, and week that current high-fertility rates persist have the effect, due to population momentum, of locking the entirety of humankind, civilization, and the biosphere more and more inescapably into the collision trajectory.)</p>
<p>Speaking as a biologist, earth’s planetary carrying capacity for a modern industrialized humanity with everyone on earth enjoying a U.S. / Western European standard of living is on the order of TWO billion on less and the U.N.’s most recent medium-fertility population projections show humankind to be on-track toward ten billion by the end of this century. We know that humanity was already inflicting damage on earth’s ecosystems, biota, and planetary life support machinery back in 1987 with five billion and 1999 with six billion – when less than half of us were industrialized. Now we are at SEVEN billion and ocean dead zones are spreading, bluefin tuna and shark populations are plunging, deforestation in Sumatra reached rates of 61% over a period of twelve years in the 1980s, and on and on.</p>
<p>Graphs depicting human population growth over the past 10,000 years are accessible at <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos./pali_nalu" rel="nofollow">http://www.flickr.com/photos./pali_nalu</a> and readers will notice that they are not JUST J-curves (like those J-curve events the world witnessed at Hiroshima and Nagasaki), but they are extreme and pronounced J-curves.  (Population is not just affected by birth rates – think about mortality reductions; biologists have already achieved SIX-FOLD life-extensions in laboratory organisms – that would be a 500-year extension in humans – and even a tiny, tiny fractional such increase in humans would send us careening toward 15.8 billion.</p>
<p>For a short freely-downloadable downloadable PDF on population and the implications of our sheer physical eradication of natural systems (Conservation &#8211; Why 10% goals are not enough”) – readers are invited to visit <a href="http://www.scribd.com/TheWecskaopProject" rel="nofollow">http://www.scribd.com/TheWecskaopProject</a> (What Every Citizen Should Know About Our Planet).</p>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://blog.nature.org/2009/11/open-thread-which-eco-issue-keeps-you-up-at-night/comment-page-2/#comment-148253</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Oct 2011 14:42:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.nature.org/?p=8123#comment-148253</guid>
		<description>Encroachment on habitat keeps me up.  I am a US citizen who has lived in Indonesia for 6 years and now in West Africa for 11 months.  As an avid bird watcher and wildlife photographer in my spare time I seek out the various habitats on where birds might be found.  I am blessed to be able to visit these prestine wild places, but brought to tears when I see it destroyed.  The process is almost always the same, someone with a chainsaw and truck hires a crew and cuts the biggest trees and hauls them to a sawmill, the logging trails open paths for others to encroach and set up residence and cut the smaller trees for pulp or poles, the final blow is when the area starts filling with grass then is burned to clear for planting.  The distance I have to travel to get to prestine primary forest gets longer every month.  The loss is real and the pace of the destruction is alarming.  There are many factors that contribute and takes a broad-based approach and relentless effort to save enough to prevent species extension.  Keep up the conservation effort and don&#039;t ever give up!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Encroachment on habitat keeps me up.  I am a US citizen who has lived in Indonesia for 6 years and now in West Africa for 11 months.  As an avid bird watcher and wildlife photographer in my spare time I seek out the various habitats on where birds might be found.  I am blessed to be able to visit these prestine wild places, but brought to tears when I see it destroyed.  The process is almost always the same, someone with a chainsaw and truck hires a crew and cuts the biggest trees and hauls them to a sawmill, the logging trails open paths for others to encroach and set up residence and cut the smaller trees for pulp or poles, the final blow is when the area starts filling with grass then is burned to clear for planting.  The distance I have to travel to get to prestine primary forest gets longer every month.  The loss is real and the pace of the destruction is alarming.  There are many factors that contribute and takes a broad-based approach and relentless effort to save enough to prevent species extension.  Keep up the conservation effort and don&#8217;t ever give up!</p>
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		<title>By: Melleen</title>
		<link>http://blog.nature.org/2009/11/open-thread-which-eco-issue-keeps-you-up-at-night/comment-page-2/#comment-146742</link>
		<dc:creator>Melleen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Sep 2011 22:55:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.nature.org/?p=8123#comment-146742</guid>
		<description>trying to get people to care for the earth, over population, and manny other things</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>trying to get people to care for the earth, over population, and manny other things</p>
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		<title>By: coffeebird</title>
		<link>http://blog.nature.org/2009/11/open-thread-which-eco-issue-keeps-you-up-at-night/comment-page-2/#comment-142943</link>
		<dc:creator>coffeebird</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Aug 2011 04:00:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.nature.org/?p=8123#comment-142943</guid>
		<description>the fact that all of nature is fragile...that the reason we are trying to &#039;conserve&#039; it is because of this, because human society is inherently dangerous to nature. that unless we have a complete overhaul of our social system (in other words unless people stop being greedy) then the beauties of nature will probably die. and the real scary part is that i don&#039;t have faith in people changing...

so what can we do as a conservationists? should we just accept the absolute rule of humanity over nature and turn into a fancy landscaping service? or should we try to keep the dream of a natural world alive?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>the fact that all of nature is fragile&#8230;that the reason we are trying to &#8216;conserve&#8217; it is because of this, because human society is inherently dangerous to nature. that unless we have a complete overhaul of our social system (in other words unless people stop being greedy) then the beauties of nature will probably die. and the real scary part is that i don&#8217;t have faith in people changing&#8230;</p>
<p>so what can we do as a conservationists? should we just accept the absolute rule of humanity over nature and turn into a fancy landscaping service? or should we try to keep the dream of a natural world alive?</p>
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		<title>By: elis</title>
		<link>http://blog.nature.org/2009/11/open-thread-which-eco-issue-keeps-you-up-at-night/comment-page-2/#comment-139888</link>
		<dc:creator>elis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Aug 2011 01:11:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.nature.org/?p=8123#comment-139888</guid>
		<description>will the planet be able to continue feeding billion more people in the future? is conservation only for elites who can afford to think and do something about it because all their basic needs are met? why some people can be so greedy they don&#039;t bother to save something for future generation and instead extract, exploit, expand, consume and consume more from nature? don&#039;t we merely borrow all resources from our children and we have moral obligation to leave the legacy intact for them? that&#039;s all for now. i have more each day..</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>will the planet be able to continue feeding billion more people in the future? is conservation only for elites who can afford to think and do something about it because all their basic needs are met? why some people can be so greedy they don&#8217;t bother to save something for future generation and instead extract, exploit, expand, consume and consume more from nature? don&#8217;t we merely borrow all resources from our children and we have moral obligation to leave the legacy intact for them? that&#8217;s all for now. i have more each day..</p>
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		<title>By: Bruce</title>
		<link>http://blog.nature.org/2009/11/open-thread-which-eco-issue-keeps-you-up-at-night/comment-page-2/#comment-138915</link>
		<dc:creator>Bruce</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Aug 2011 00:34:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.nature.org/?p=8123#comment-138915</guid>
		<description>Human beings in general.  As a whole, we make me sick.  How, as the most &quot;intelligent&quot; beings on Earth, can we do so many terrible things?  A lot of mistakes have been made and we&#039;ve learned from some of them but then there are things that we just keep doing wrong.  I worry about what the world will be when my grand children are here and, as a natural resources professional, what I will have to tell them to explain it.  As of right now, there are only 2 honest explainations I can give: 1) we&#039;re lazy  2) we&#039;re stupid.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Human beings in general.  As a whole, we make me sick.  How, as the most &#8220;intelligent&#8221; beings on Earth, can we do so many terrible things?  A lot of mistakes have been made and we&#8217;ve learned from some of them but then there are things that we just keep doing wrong.  I worry about what the world will be when my grand children are here and, as a natural resources professional, what I will have to tell them to explain it.  As of right now, there are only 2 honest explainations I can give: 1) we&#8217;re lazy  2) we&#8217;re stupid.</p>
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		<title>By: sim gamba</title>
		<link>http://blog.nature.org/2009/11/open-thread-which-eco-issue-keeps-you-up-at-night/comment-page-2/#comment-138750</link>
		<dc:creator>sim gamba</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Aug 2011 01:25:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.nature.org/?p=8123#comment-138750</guid>
		<description>It is man&#039;s foolish thinking that he owns the earth and he will be around forever.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is man&#8217;s foolish thinking that he owns the earth and he will be around forever.</p>
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		<title>By: Jane</title>
		<link>http://blog.nature.org/2009/11/open-thread-which-eco-issue-keeps-you-up-at-night/comment-page-2/#comment-137370</link>
		<dc:creator>Jane</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jul 2011 00:33:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.nature.org/?p=8123#comment-137370</guid>
		<description>The talk of issues that weren&#039;t issues at all when I was a kid, ie severe and violent weather changes, the loss of polar bears, rapidly disappearing ice to name a few. 

The general state of global issues in terms of massive unemployment, loss of livelihoods, uncertainess of the future for my own child.  When people have these immediate concerns to deal with just to survive on a daily basis, how can they be truly concerned about the environment? 

It&#039;s a vicious circle.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The talk of issues that weren&#8217;t issues at all when I was a kid, ie severe and violent weather changes, the loss of polar bears, rapidly disappearing ice to name a few. </p>
<p>The general state of global issues in terms of massive unemployment, loss of livelihoods, uncertainess of the future for my own child.  When people have these immediate concerns to deal with just to survive on a daily basis, how can they be truly concerned about the environment? </p>
<p>It&#8217;s a vicious circle.</p>
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		<title>By: Mary Rondoni</title>
		<link>http://blog.nature.org/2009/11/open-thread-which-eco-issue-keeps-you-up-at-night/comment-page-2/#comment-136485</link>
		<dc:creator>Mary Rondoni</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jul 2011 13:38:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.nature.org/?p=8123#comment-136485</guid>
		<description>When individuals are done eating and they throw their lunch or dinner refuse out the car window I am enraged. Also, after drinking beer in the car individuals just leave the bottles on the public way or lawn they happened to be parked by. Littering is against the law and mother nature.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When individuals are done eating and they throw their lunch or dinner refuse out the car window I am enraged. Also, after drinking beer in the car individuals just leave the bottles on the public way or lawn they happened to be parked by. Littering is against the law and mother nature.</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew</title>
		<link>http://blog.nature.org/2009/11/open-thread-which-eco-issue-keeps-you-up-at-night/comment-page-2/#comment-135727</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Jul 2011 19:29:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.nature.org/?p=8123#comment-135727</guid>
		<description>A digital aged, tech savvy, computer guided youth (ages 2-20) which rarely goes outside to play, nor do they seem to have any desire to do so.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A digital aged, tech savvy, computer guided youth (ages 2-20) which rarely goes outside to play, nor do they seem to have any desire to do so.</p>
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